46 replies to this topic

[Limelight]

So I remember when Sun Valley Idaho started installing their new Yan HSQs in 1993, and how they kept having some kind of issues with them. And I've seen several other references around this site regarding other problems with the lifts. So overall, what kind of issues did the resorts have with the Yan HSQ? Were they unsafe?

[liftmech]

The issues you refer to were regarding the YAN detachable grip. It was of a design that in retrospect wasn't properly engineered. After a grip failure at Whistler that resulted in two deaths, every area that owned YAN detachable grips retrofitted their lifts to remove that grip from service. Lake Louise and Silver Star, both in Canada, contracted with Pol-X West to build a better grip that would work with their existing equipment. All others that I'm aware of removed all YAN grips and terminal equipment at the least and replaced them with Doppelmayr or Poma equipment.

[Limelight]

OK, thats what I remember. After a couple of years, Sun Valley changed all the chairs, and terminals on their HSQs. So how much is still the original YAN product? Is it mostly Doppelmayr now.

This post has been edited by Limelight: 01 April 2006 - 07:46 PM

[SkiBachelor]

Hi Ryan,

Check out the the Sun Valley page here on Skilifts.org. If you view some of the pages, you will see that most of the original equipment still remains. :)

http://skilifts.org/id-sunvalley.htm

[WBSKI]

if they did change the Silver Star grips then why did they replace them since they had the same capacity as the current lifts?

[SkiBachelor]

Maybe Silver Star was wanting to remove the lifts and never had the money to do it until Big White purchased the ski area?

[Peter]

Here is a list of all the Yan High Speed Quads and what happened to them.

Alpine Meadows, California AM Express Installed in 1989 and replaced with a Doppelmayr 6 pack in 1996
Sierra-at-Tahoe, California Sensation Express Installed in 1989 and replaced with a Doppelmayr high speed quad in 1996
Sierra-at-Tahoe, California Lower Express Installed in 1992 and replaced with a Doppelmayr high speed quad in 1996
Sierra-at-Tahoe, California Easy Street Express Installed in 1991 and replaced with a Doppelmayr high speed quad in 1996
Mammoth Mountain, California Broadway Express Installed in 1988 and Retrofitted by Doppelmayr
Mammoth Mountain, California Canyon Express Installed in 1994 and Retrofitted by Doppelmayr
June Mountain, California Chair 6 Installed in 1986 and Retrofitted by Doppelmayr
June Mountain, California Chair 7 Installed in 1987 and Retrofitted by Doppelmayr
Silver Star, British Columbia Vance Creek Express Installed in 1991, new grips by Pol-X-West, Replaced with a Leitner-Poma High Speed Quad in 2002
Silver Star, British Columbia Putnam Creek Express Installed in 1991, new grips by Pol-X-West, Replaced with a Leitner-Poma High Speed Quad in 2002
Whistler Mountain, British Columbia Greenline Express Installed in 1990, Replaced by Doppelmayr in 1997
Whistler Mountain, British Columbia Redline Express Installed in 1990, Replaced by Doppelmayr in 1997
Whistler Mountain, British Columbia Quicksilver Express Installed in 1991, Replaced by a Poma Gondola in 1996
Deer Valley, Utah Carpenter Express Installed in 1990, Replaced with a Garaventa CTEC High Speed Quad in 1996
Park City, Utah Prospector Express Installed in 1989, Replaced with a Garaventa CTEC 6 Pack in 1996
Sun Valley, Idaho River Run Express Installed in 1992, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Sun Valley, Idaho Christmas Express Installed in 1988, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Sun Valley, Idaho Lookout Express Installed in 1993, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Sun Valley, Idaho Greyhawk Express Installed in 1988, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Sun Valley, Idaho Frenchman's Express Installed in 1994, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Sun Valley, Idaho Challenger Express Installed in 1988, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Sun Valley, Idaho Seattle Ridge Express Installed in 1993, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr in 1995
Schweitzer, Idaho Great Escape Express Installed in 1990, Retrofitted by Doppelmayr
Killington, Vermont Superstar Express Installed in 1987, Retrofitted by Poma
Killington, Vermont Snowshed Express Installed in 1987, Retrofitted by Poma
Mount Snow, Vermont Grand Summit Express Installed in 1987, Retrofitted by Poma
Pico, Vermont Summit Express Installed in 1988, Retrofitted by Poma
Pico, Vermont Golden Express Installed in 1987, Retrofitted by Poma
Lake Louise, Alberta Top of the World Express Installed in 1989, new grips by Pol-X-West, Replaced with a Leitner-Poma 6pack in 2003
Lake Louise, Alberta Friendly Giant Express Installed in 1989, new grips by Pol-X-West, Removed in 2004
Sunday River, Maine Sunday River Express Installed in 1987, Retrofitted by Poma

[mmsa]

If I am not mistaken the Yan 7 grip is still in use in Japan today. All Yan High Speed detachables on Federal lands, Forest Service land, had to be replaced in 97.

[SkiBachelor]

So there was more than 31 Yan HSQs built by Yan?

[liftmech]

mmsa, on Apr 2 2006, 11:05 AM, said:

If I am not mistaken the Yan 7 grip is still in use in Japan today. All Yan High Speed detachables on Federal lands, Forest Service land, had to be replaced in 97.

That explains why only Canadian areas bought the Pol-X redesign.

[spunkyskier01]

anyone have pics of the yan high speed quads in their original form, not like the ones at mammoth

[Peter]

here are some pics

Attached File(s)

•  friendly_giant_line.jpg (9.1K)
  Number of downloads: 148
•  lo6.jpg (37.24K)
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•  old_yan_hsq.jpg (79.81K)
  Number of downloads: 106
•  mid.jpg (49.38K)
  Number of downloads: 118
•  sunvalleyhsq.jpg (245.29K)
  Number of downloads: 146
•  bubble.jpg (145.98K)
  Number of downloads: 122
•  bubble2.jpg (153.67K)
  Number of downloads: 88
•  vancecreek.jpg (156.54K)
  Number of downloads: 128

This post has been edited by Skier: 04 April 2006 - 02:56 PM

[Jonni]

I must say despite the problems that there was with the Yan detachable grip, Yan did very well in designing his terminals to make them look streamlined and very futuristic.

[Peter]

This brings up an obvious question. Could it happen again? If a Doppelmayr or Poma lift had an accident, would the company go under? It seems like resorts would try to avoid the problem company, even if it was only for marketing reasons. What would happen if there was only one lift manufacturer!

[liftmech]

I'm quite certain there were others besides Jan who 'used customers as test beds'. I'm surprised there haven't been more publicized issues on other manufacturers.

[skiersage]

To answer some questions,
The reason why yan hsq's that had Pol-x west grips were replaced was because the new grips did not fixed the rest of the terminal woes and other problems that the lifts had. The following quote sums it up nicely:

barnstormer, on Apr 6 2006, 01:09 PM, said:

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'll bet you never worked on one of these. Any work that needed to be done on the accelerators, decelerators or conveyers was done outside, in the elements. To change terminal tire, you had to remove it's gearbox but since there was no terminal, there was nothing to lift it with. There wasn't really any way to get at the coupling/uncoupling areas except from underneath. Same with the driver wheels. To take a chair offline, you had to remove a section of the turn around rail and lower the chair to the ground with winch. Yan had some good ideas but those terminals sucked from a mechanic's point of view. They certainly inspired a lot of aftermarket creativity for us to get around these issues...

So that is why the silver star lifts were replaced.

Another popular question is why do yan lifts make bigger headlines than when, for example, the hsq at sunapee (Poma) threw a chair out of the terminal. I think that I have finally figured out why this is true. Riblet clips are ejected from the haul rope every so often. The average is about three a year! So why is this not a big deal? The reason is because most of the time, Riblet clips fell off the line because of accidents not because of error of manufacturing. likewise, yan lifts had accidents because of poorly manufactured or poorly designed (or both) parts. When these things broke, it arose suspicion if lift engineering was cutting too many costs to make lifts affordable. Other lift brands do not get as much attention because there was not worries about companies cutting costs and therefore making lifts unsafe.

All in all, Yan had some of the best designs out there but did not take the time or money to make sure they were totally safe. If he did I am sure we would still be seeing some of yan's "revolutions" being built today.

[poloxskier]

Also one of the reasons I think that it recieved so much bad press was that when the the whistler accident occured it was possible for news to spred arround the world almost imediately. Where as the Vail accident occured in another time and its impact has signifigantly faded and hardly anyone who doesnt work in the industry or is knowledgeable about lifts and skiing even knows about it. The Vail gondola accident was another situation but was equaly as tragic

This post has been edited by poloxskier: 06 April 2006 - 06:06 PM

[SkiBachelor]

Actually, Doppelmayr was in the process of purchasing Lift Engineering before the Whistler accident. However, maybe Lift Engineering would have still been in business today if it hadn't run into some of the inncidents that it did in the 80s, like with the Keystone gondola, QMC lift and Teller accident.

[okemopoma]

Emax, on Apr 9 2006, 09:28 AM, said:

"yan lifts had accidents because of poorly manufactured or poorly designed (or both) parts. When these things broke, it arose suspicion if lift engineering was cutting too many costs to make lifts affordable."

Unfortunately, you are correct.

Hence came the saying........

(Y)our (A)irborn (N)ow

Sorry, just had to sneak that one in.

[Outback]

Quote

All kidding aside, the man was and is a genius. He was also a great boss.

Thank you for the last comment......many will never know.